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[PTU] Advanced Classes; Why? For the glory of Giratina of course!
Topic Started: Dec 4 2017, 08:02 PM (3,715 Views)
Sgt. Cookie
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With 2.0 being the next iteration of PTU, and that iteration being a loooooooooong time off, I say let’s go hog wild and push the theoretical limits of .05 to its absolute maximum. And then break that limit because, fuck it, we’re homebrewers. Crazy shit’s our stock and trade. So, without further ado, I present to you:

(Given that it’s, y’know, ME making this, do not be gentle with criticism.)


Advanced Classes

Advanced Classes function in many ways to normal classes, however, there are some key differences. For starters, Advanced Classes don’t take up class slots, instead, a Trainer gains one Advanced Class slot at level 12, when Master level skills are available. (If you’re using Fanatic Rat’s Level Compression rules, the slot is gained at level 6.)

Secondly, Advanced Classes don’t have Skill rank prerequisites. Instead, they require that you possess features from ordinary classes. Which is what you’d expect for this sort of thing.

Lastly, some features, except for the base feature of the advanced class, only have one prerequisite. Most of the time, this means that the feature in question is hybridising the base feature of the class. Which you’re going to have inherently. (Sometimes it means I’ve cocked something up, but it should be obvious when I’ve done that.)

Generally speaking, Advanced Class features hybridise two different features, but from time to time they’re their own thing with only a tangential relationship to their prerequisite features.

Current list of advanced classes completed


Smooth Criminal
Rogue/Provocateur

Spoiler: click to toggle


Paladin
(Sage/Fortress)

Spoiler: click to toggle


Occultist
(Hex Maniac/Arcanist)

Spoiler: click to toggle


Support Scout
(Hunter/Marksman)

Spoiler: click to toggle

Edited by Sgt. Cookie, Dec 9 2017, 08:12 AM.
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l33tmaan
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These still take up regular features, right? I think it's unlikely for people to take 4 classes AND 2 advanced classes at the same time. A trainer will have at most 31 features to choose, and 4 classes will eat up around 20-24 features. That leaves enough to go halfway into two advanced classes or all the way into one, and that's assuming that they never take anything but class features.
I would argue that you should limit the advanced classes to one at a time and make them count towards the regular class limit. I like the idea of classes that rely on advancing in earlier classes and hybridize their character, but unless I'm misunderstanding something, there simply isn't enough room to make use of more than one at a time.
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Sgt. Cookie
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The reason I chose two slots was because I liked the idea of going 4 to 2. While you're right in that it prevents you from fully finishing both, only having one seems... Too little somehow. Maybe I'll change it at some point, though.
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l33tmaan
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Why does it seem too little?
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Sgt. Cookie
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I don't really know. Gut reaction, I suppose. Since Advanced Classes merge two regular ones, it just... Feels too little to not be able to merge both pairs. Even if only a little.
Edited by Sgt. Cookie, Dec 5 2017, 06:52 PM.
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l33tmaan
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Game design, even when it's homebrewed, should be based more on reals than feels.
To me, it feels like combining two of your classes into one souped-up hybrid class is already defining enough for a character. Two advanced classes feels... muddy. But the math is more important here.
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Sgt. Cookie
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That's true. Alright, you've convinced me. I'll change it down to one.
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l33tmaan
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I like the idea so much that I'm going to see if my players are into it at all. While I can't say how balanced your advanced classes are for certain, I can say they're all thematically strong and seem solid enough in combat as well. Have you playtested them at all?
If you don't mind me, I'm going to try my hand at some of my own that are based on my players' classes.

Analyst

Cavalier
Edited by l33tmaan, Dec 5 2017, 11:27 PM.
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Xavion
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l33tmaan
Dec 5 2017, 08:52 PM
I like the idea so much that I'm going to see if my players are into it at all. While I can't say how balanced your advanced classes are for certain, I can say they're all thematically strong and seem solid enough in combat as well. Have you playtested them at all?
If you don't mind me, I'm going to try my hand at some of my own that are based on my players' classes.

Analyst
So I was wondering how good well studied actually is, it looked questionable to me as I couldn't remember that much with the ed skills, so here is some analysis. Here's the breakdown, all the available features and edges, and summarised.

Feature/Edge Count
SkillFeaturesEdges
General Ed14
Tech Ed13
Poke Ed34
Medi Ed12
Occult Ed02
Survival06


General Ed

Tech Ed

Poke Ed

Medi Ed

Occult Ed

Survival


As can be easily seen, not all skills are close to equal. Occult has it worst with no features and two edges, and the majority of occult researchers should already have Gem Lore as it is a great edge and a prereq for one of the two branches that uses the skill. As written it's also unclear whether you have to meet normal prereqs, if you do then Medi and Tech both have secondary requirements to take their feature, and Poke for one. If you don't then having Poke Ed as a research skill allows you to get Focused Command without having any ranks in Command. Taking your example of General/Climatology, the only option for Well-Studied is to take two instances of Tutoring each time, which isn't the best.

For the rest of it, Breadth of Knowledge is already used by the intro General Research feature so I suggest you change that name. It's alright as a feature though, Dormant Genius seems a bit meh as a feature, effective +2.5 to rolls you have Virtuso on? The abilities one is nice, though naturally the effectiveness of the abilities varies. It may also be worth including abilities for the three DPDoM branches for completness.
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l33tmaan
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That's some solid feedback, I knew the class was wonky, but I wasn't sure how to handle things.

I've added the DPDoM branches to Analyst, tweaked the effect from Dormant Genius and gave it to Well-Studied, and I completely reworked Dormant Genius to something maybe more fitting for a capstone?
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