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[PTU][Misc] Pokemon Mystery Dungeon Sourcebook v1.12; Pre Alpha of a revamped PMD System, now v 1.12
Topic Started: Apr 10 2016, 07:03 AM (6,022 Views)
Flamewolf9
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It comes from FPS games I believe. It's a game state where the best way to play is total offence. Any resources devoted to defence are ultimately meaningless because of how overwhelming a characters offensive potential is.
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FanaticRat
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ok a few responses"

1. Regarding stats, you start out with rank 1 in added stats and have 5 ranks to add at level 1, but can only add up to 3 at chargen

2. Regarding vitamins, I hadn't considered those. Right now, I'd say that a vitamin raises a base stat by 1 base stat rank but can only raise an individual base stat rank once. I'll figure something out later.

3. Regarding rocket tag, that's one of the reasons why I"m doing playtesting tbh. I wanted to see if the stat system actually worked, and I can't do that or fix it without playtesting data. That being said, I wanted to at the very least move away from the hyper stall defense I saw in the last version.
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Flamewolf9
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FanaticRat
Apr 15 2016, 09:34 PM
ok a few responses"

1. Regarding stats, you start out with rank 1 in added stats and have 5 ranks to add at level 1, but can only add up to 3 at chargen

2. Regarding vitamins, I hadn't considered those. Right now, I'd say that a vitamin raises a base stat by 1 base stat rank but can only raise an individual base stat rank once. I'll figure something out later.

3. Regarding rocket tag, that's one of the reasons why I"m doing playtesting tbh. I wanted to see if the stat system actually worked, and I can't do that or fix it without playtesting data. That being said, I wanted to at the very least move away from the hyper stall defense I saw in the last version.
Thanks for the feedback. I was running the numbers trying to munchkin a build to push the current system to it's extremes. My current assessment is that you want pokemon like umbreon. That is pokemon who have high base defenses and hp, then to focus on attack as much has possible while keeping your evasion high enough. That pokemon will easily shut out any value an offensive pokemon get from base stats, while maximizing your ability to focus on a hammering a single defense constantly.

I have one other significant gripes that I've commented left in the doc for now. I'm not ready to go into full detail yet as this is also an issue I have with the core PTU as well. I'd like to bring a recipe to the table rather than just throw salt into the pot (I should get food soon).
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The Sneaky Prinny
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A few broad thoughts that may or may not be relevant to the aims and goals of a PMD set.

Inventory Management: A big part of Rougelikes is managing your supply of powerful consumables carefully to get yourself out of a jam. Thus far, there seems to only be consumables and equipment available. Including a bunch of Seeds and Orbs (a data entry headache, to be sure) could help move the experience more into line with that Rougelike flavor, if that is the goal.

If that does become a thing, I'd also suggest a class whose point is Inventory management. They can carry more stuff, use it better than others, and scrounge goodies from places where others found nothing but lint.

I also find it a bit odd that there is not a "Sneak Guy" class. I feel like Ninja could translate over well, especially since weapon use is a more common thing.

While I totally get why the Warrior gets Smithing, I feel like a class dedicated to creating equipment, whether weapon, armor, or accessory might work better. I could be wrong, though.

A thought on balance:
Improving the power of each HP stat point could go quite a long way to reducing the Rocket Tag effect, and give defensive strategies a good base. It also would mean that the threat of multiple enemies in sequence would shoot up, making crowds of baddies more dangerous, as they should be in a rougelike.
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FanaticRat
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Quote:
 
A few broad thoughts that may or may not be relevant to the aims and goals of a PMD set.

Inventory Management: A big part of Rougelikes is managing your supply of powerful consumables carefully to get yourself out of a jam. Thus far, there seems to only be consumables and equipment available. Including a bunch of Seeds and Orbs (a data entry headache, to be sure) could help move the experience more into line with that Rougelike flavor, if that is the goal.


The goal is not to directly simulate the games or make this like a rougelike. The purpose is to simply make rules for a game in which players can play pokemon PCs. The term PMD is a bit loaded in that regard but it's the inspiration and most relatable media. That being said, seeds and orbs and stuff might come in down the line but right now I want to focus on getting a good base before branching out into making more stuff.

Quote:
 
I also find it a bit odd that there is not a "Sneak Guy" class. I feel like Ninja could translate over well, especially since weapon use is a more common thing.


Perhaps down the line.

Quote:
 
While I totally get why the Warrior gets Smithing, I feel like a class dedicated to creating equipment, whether weapon, armor, or accessory might work better. I could be wrong, though.


The first version of this had researcher, but I ultimately removed it because no one used it. I felt combining the crafting parts into classes with more active roles would make the classes more attractive and directly useful for the class.

Quote:
 
A thought on balance:
Improving the power of each HP stat point could go quite a long way to reducing the Rocket Tag effect, and give defensive strategies a good base. It also would mean that the threat of multiple enemies in sequence would shoot up, making crowds of baddies more dangerous, as they should be in a rougelike.


Thanks. I'll look into boosting hp.
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FanaticRat
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Also a heads up, current list of things I'm going to be changing or removing:

-DR and things that give DR will soon receive a nerf
-Combat stages will be changed, probably an incremental die increase (1d4->1d6->1d8 etc)
-Any feature that lowers PP cost will be removed. Forgot to remove them from a previous version
-Enhancer is gonna get nerfed. At the very least, Combat Knowledge will be put far far further into the class
-Type ace is getting changed. Especially plainly perfect
-Things that give temp hp will likely be changed or nerfed

Also, working on addind some new classes. Been brainstorming how to convert ninja and oracle, and also have been trying to think up a good tech edu class. Also hope to add in some GM advice and a way to simplify making enemies. Any other suggestions?
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Flamewolf9
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I'd say make a pass on the level up options. Any option to learn moves from the current move bracket lowers your long term effectiveness compared to the other options if you don't take moves you want to keep permanently. I put my proposals in the comments in the doc.
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FanaticRat
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I saw that and also commented in the doc. I don't quite understand what you mean by lowering your long term effectiveness, however. I will mention, though, that I made it an option instead of an inbuilt feature because at some point you run out of moves, so I didn't want people to feel they had to gain something 'dead'.
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Flamewolf9
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The issue is that eventually you'll have to overwrite moves if you want more powerful ones at higher levels. The process of overwritting moves effectively negates the long term benefits gained from taking the option to gain moves previously. No other option from the list has this downside. Once they are selected they will be in effect until the character is retired. That's why I proposed having the ability to learn new moves occur every level instead of having to choose it over other benefits.

Also this isn't an issue for Tutor moves you can choose exactly which move you want instead of wasting resources on moves that you don't want in the long term.

As an example, on Framps I only took the Learn a Move option once at 5th level because with that I could get every move that I wanted with that one choice. That freed up all my previous options for edges, movement capabilities, and other goodies.
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FanaticRat
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If I do that I'll still need some alternative for when you run out of moves you want to take: the idea is that when you hit that point you can grab two things per level that interest you, instead of only one while a progression feature is essentially worthless. Perhaps some sort of happy medium would be having the gain move opting be a choice of two different options, and the other option be all the currently listed options?
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